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darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 11 2017, 06:32 PM


Oh san
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The best way to get back at him is to stop playing the game. It should be clear to everyone that KRU will always be ran by Wony so long as you folks keep giving him money.

Stop giving him your money and investing your time into his games, and he'll be forced to either sell to new owners or shut down. Either outcome isn't good for him.

Literally the only way you can beat Wony is by letting Nexus die.

  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121735 · Replies: 13 · Views: 391

darkmaverick
Posted on: Aug 28 2017, 07:57 PM


Oh san
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It has several PVP events which are all a thousand times more fun than elixir wars.

Freakin Triple Triad tournaments in FFXIV are more fun than elixir wars. And Chocobo Racing
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121693 · Replies: 14 · Views: 1,306

darkmaverick
Posted on: May 20 2017, 03:32 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (Genji Works @ May 19 2017, 08:19 PM) *
If the game owners are not going to money and effort to update the game client or produce events for their paying customers. Why keep on feeding them?


This is the main reason to not play.

The current GMs can clearly script new dungeons, spells, items, and fix broken features.

Yet they waste their time on [Content removed] designed to be Kruna shop cash grabs or band-aid fixes to critically broken design flaws (ex. Ee san culture trial).

I mean how many months have they wasted on this "experience adjustment" mechanic which just doesn't need to exist if they'd fix the actual game design problems that create the player shortages to begin with? Sure they made Tangun optional now but that doesn't change the fact levels 1-99 are some of the most boring [Content removed]ing gameplay in the history of MMORPGs, especially when this game has to compete with the likes of FF XIV and WoW?

The most novel gameplay aspect NexusTK has going for it isn't subpaths and their elitist "king of the hill" bull[Content removed]. It's the stat purchasing 99+ mechanics. By putting the most interesting gameplay mechanics at the end of level 99 and making the most boring aspect the stuff newbies are introduced to, they make it tough to get new players. Besides once they finally get to 99+ there are now too many dungeons, so the once linear path to advancement is confusing as hell. They need to close 50% of the dungeons that exist right now and start consolidating the small playerbase. And the "Justice system" needs to be scrapped. No professional MMO company allows players to have punishment powers, or has policies where people get punished by saying non-profanity but another player just decided to be horribly offended at something trivial and dumb. People like Teragg entrusted with these powers behave like Fundamentalist Mormon cult leaders. If I owned NexusTK I swear Terragg would be the first person I ban because he's toxic to the community and aside from Sarina and tip, has done more to harm the game's financial prospects than any other player by running the Judge system like a Gestapo. I'm in the NexusTK related FB groups, I have seen for myself the stupid trivial nonsense that Terragg and co. are jailing people for, screenshots of the logs and all. He needs a perm ban from this game and to get a [Content removed]ing life. If he was employed as a community manager at any semi-professional game company his ass would be fired a long time ago.

Combine with this the majority of the PvE experience being a room camp experience killing waves of respawning enemies rather than the encounter based dungeon design every other MMORPG adopted, NexusTK is way behind the curve and the GMs just aren't even trying to make it a competitive game.

NexusTK needs another Great Shift. It needs a Cataclysm. They need to take a hint from WoW and FF XIV, and redesign the whole goddamn game to be relevant in today's market. Until they do this nothing is going to change, 90% of the ex-players will never return and they will keep failing to convert 99% of the new players that try it out.

But that isn't likely to occur until the game comes under new ownership and that won't happen until Wony finally gives up and sells the company to someone who can actually manage it in a financially responsible way. I mean it's hard to believe NexusTK was one of the first MMOs on the market in North America and it's had one of the worst financial performances of any MMO.

They don't even have a Facebook Page for their games. Can you believe that? The most amazing marketing platform in the world capable of generating tens of thousands of laser-targeted customer leads a day for $0, and they don't even try to utilize it. Facebook has now been around for a decade and never once have they even tried to make a Page and use it to market the game.

They have no idea how to run a commercial company, let alone a game publisher. There's no hope for NexusTK under its current ownership. They aren't even trying and if you believe otherwise you're just an idiot.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121663 · Replies: 19 · Views: 1,850

darkmaverick
Posted on: May 13 2017, 01:31 AM


Oh san
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He doesn't.

http://users.nexustk.com/webreport/Chongun.htm

  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121658 · Replies: 19 · Views: 1,850

darkmaverick
Posted on: Apr 8 2017, 01:02 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (Leto @ Apr 7 2017, 03:46 PM) *
I have created three tickets that nobody has replied to.


That isn't "shadow-banning".....

That's just business as usual for KRU.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121643 · Replies: 14 · Views: 1,306

darkmaverick
Posted on: Mar 5 2017, 08:19 PM


Oh san
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They should just make the game free to play and totally eliminate character levels. The real game is about selling experience to buy stats and using stat based abilities. And those abilities aren't really useful pre-99.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121605 · Replies: 14 · Views: 1,541

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 14 2016, 12:03 AM


Oh san
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"Your point is moot" is a common expression when someone makes a statement that has no relevance to the topic being discussed. There is vast consensus on this.

http://english.stackexchange.com/questions...e-point-is-moot

"The adjective moot is originally a legal term going back to the mid-16th century. It derives from the noun moot, in its sense of a hypothetical case argued as an exercise by law students. Consequently, a moot question is one that is arguable or open to debate.

But in the mid-19th century people also began to look at the hypothetical side of moot as its essential meaning, and they started to use the word to mean "of no significance or relevance." Thus, a moot point, however debatable, is one that has no practical value."


So, don't look for an alternate use of the phrase that nobody has been using since the 1800s, and focus on the one people actually use today. That is how it was meant and you know that.

Of course, I do understand you would prefer to engage in arguments of semantics because you cannot prove your main point -- that there is demand for a second NexusTK server. But I am not willing to chase you around in circles while you make semantical arguments because it's just a derailment.

QUOTE
I've said this so many times by now to please you guys - it doesn't have to be a retro server. Stop fixating on that please. The point is it needs to get a significant number of people to sub at the same time.


You are not saying that NexusTK needs a second server using the same mechanics and content it has right now. You want to scrap substantial amounts of the content so it goes back to an earlier build of the game. "Retro server" is just a placeholder for what you want, because writing it out as I just did is too many words all the time. So stop trying to act like this isn't your main argument by focusing on the semantics of what you believe "retro server" could mean, and focus on what it actually means in the context of this discussion.


Also, just because I don't quote your entire posts doesn't mean I am not responding to your posts. I already gave satisfactory responses to all statements you've made. For purposes of brevity I chose to not quote block your entire essay and instead focus on the crux of your arguments. I am not going to sit here and respond line by line to your earlier rant, nor am I going to go around in circles with you about dopamine releases and game design mechanics. My prior response about how the research is still greatly lacking and is not understood to the point we can make accurate statements like you are trying to, still stands.


QUOTE
Err, I gave you a list and you said it meant nothing. Now all of a sudden a list has value? You contradict yourself quite a bit. Try not to do that in your book.


You don't have a list! What are you even arguing here?
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121533 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 13 2016, 03:20 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 13 2016, 10:00 AM) *
At its peak? Why the hell would you ever think it's OK to compare it to that? Getting 100 players to play on a new server would be an enormous success at this point. Any significant growth when the game is at 66 active avg. players is a huge win for a stagnating or dying MMO.


100 new players would not be an enormous success. I've posted before about the financial costs of NexusTK.

I'm not comparing NexusTK in any way that I wouldn't assess any other business venture. 100 new customers might be good for a B2B enterprise class product, but not a B2C consumer focused entertainment product like an MMO.

QUOTE
If by moot you mean debatable, yes, definitely.


No, by "moot" I mean completely irrelevant. You don't get to redefine the English language to suit your argument.

QUOTE
It's still evidence that there is always going to be some demand for a new server.


IT IS NOT EVIDENCE.

I don't know how to make this any [Content removed]ing clearer dude.

People lie. People misremember. People do not tell the truth.

Survey responses can at best be used to form a hypothesis.

Five [Content removed]ing people on reddit saying they would do something does not provide evidence that they will even do it, nor can their survey responses be used to make an accurate prediction for what thousands of other players would do, let alone the hundred you think might return.

QUOTE
You love making things all-or-nothing, but this so clearly isn't an all-or-nothing thing. You can't possibly say there would be zero interest.


I am not saying there would be zero interest. I am saying there is no evidence to suggest there would be any interest, and when there is no evidence to suggest something that doesn't mean you assume the possibility that evidence exists must mean it exists. That is some serious failure of logic. You're engaging in the fallacy of many possible worlds, which while it may have some value in computer programming where environments are virtual in nature, certainly has no application whatsoever to the real physical world we live in.

Just as people saying God exists is not evidence that God exists, people saying they would try a reset retro NexusTK server is no evidence they would actually do it. And when all you can get is a fisthul of people to say they would do it, out of the thousands of people who have played the game over the years, you can't even claim there is interest in the venture.

QUOTE
I maintain that you're both overestimating how many people would need to sub for it to be profitable (kruna, kruna, kruna sales) and underestimating how many random former players would try it out and get hooked again.


The burden of proof lies with the person making the claim. You claim hundreds of people would return, when you have no list of these people who have even said they would. I am rightly pointing out you have no proof and you are upset because I will not imagine along with you that proof exists.


QUOTE
Lol at thinking dopamine = pseudo-science. Jesus, man.


No, it's because I am actually familiar with the research that has been done on the topic and recognizing that you are not by the way you talk about it.

QUOTE
Let's ignore the word dopamine for a second since you love being a baby who fixates on things like car keys jiggling above them while missing the meat of someone's argument. In your book, you're going to talk about good and bad design choices, correct? Are you actually trying to say that good and bad design choices have no effect on the player's brain?


I'm not going to discuss it to the degree I talk in terms of physiology; why would I do that? The research is nowhere near to the point we perfectly understand how to manipulate this stuff in terms of chemical process. Else there would be a cure for all kinds of addictions already.

The book, like all game design books, talks about the theory of design. It uses examples of poor design and the consequences of which, and how the feature could have been designed better to produce the desired outcome which was not gained by the inferior design. It is about how to design well, and the topic of dopamine and brain research doesn't need to come up at all. You can talk about the subject without perfectly understanding the underlying brain function of thinking; we only need to go by the actual observations to form a workable and useful theory of how people respond to different game mechanics in certain situations. Just like how you do not need to go to automotive mechanics course to understand how to complete a driver's test for your state license exam. Needing to know how to operate a vehicle and needing to know how the car functions to its bare necessities are two different things.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121531 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 13 2016, 01:58 AM


Oh san
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QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 12 2016, 11:41 PM) *
The point is that a blank slate has been proven to attract players and be fun, even when the product is subpar/buggy. People like DM and Doctor don't like this proof because it hurts their argument that literally zero people want to play a new NTK server.


No, it's because a blank slate NexusTK server has not been proven to attract players.

Even if you mean the private servers, they had some rather improved feature sets compared to anything that has ever been in NexusTK, and even then the server populations never exceeded what NexusTK has attracted. So your point here is totally moot. Those servers are also free to play, whereas NexusTK costs money. There's millions of people playing on private Ragnarok Online servers who will never pay for an official subscription. Basing a business decision on what people do when they aren't asked for money is how people lose their shirts on a venture. They think doing a free trial and getting users equates to cash. It does not.

Also I don't think I've commented on this before, but you seem to completely misunderstand how dopamine works, and are relying on a lot of very questionable pseudo-scientific psychology babble as some kind of proof for your arguments. Dopamine is just a neurotransmitter and while it plays a role in pleasure, it's far from being understood to the point it is an exact science to "schedule dopamine releases" in a videogame design.

Also, equating Flappy Bird to NexusTK is just dumb. Firstly, Flabby Bird was released for mobile devices and designed to be a short time waster for when people are on a bus or waiting on their laundry or standing in a line or something. MMOs requires a major time investment, and if you're going to invest time into something you want it to be the best kind of game. Second of all, Flappy bird was a free download and made its revenue from in-game ads.

The best comparison is Illutia, which you avoid because it clearly demonstrates the version of NexusTK you want to see in the market would do no better than what NexusTK is doing right now.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121524 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 12 2016, 02:17 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 12 2016, 09:36 AM) *
Way to just completely blow past my block of text and not address a single thing in it.


I did address your, as you say, wall of text.

Not doing it again because in your latest post, you managed to just repeat yourself and all of my responses would be the same as I wrote in my last post. So, just re-read that one again?

  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121517 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 11 2016, 10:24 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 11 2016, 12:46 AM) *
DM getting rekt in 3...2...1...


lol no.

QUOTE
Website being broken is quite the red flag. At least NTK has the (lolworthy) "Comming soon" in some sections of its game guide, but a broken link is unprofessional af and shows instantly that it's just another bad knockoff made by a hobbyist.


A broken link on a website has nothing to do with the quality of the videogame. For all we know they are updating something on the forum and the link broke. This is just a poor excuse for why you won't download the game and see what it is. The forum software and the game software are unrelated.


Mind you, I am not saying Illutia is a good game. I am saying you cannot determine if it is one on the basis of a broken website link. That is a completely absurd argument, and it is this kind of tendency to logical fallacy that taints your objectivity on this issue. You just do not want to check the game out and see it's not as fun to play old-school NexusTK mechanics as you recall.

QUOTE
All I had to do was look at one screenshot to know that it wasn't even a NTK clone. No thx.


First of all, graphics do not define what a game is or isn't; the game mechanics do. Game mechanics are unrelated to visual assets. As an example, Star Wars branded Monopoly is the same game as playing regular Monopoly even if the SW branded one uses SW character dies and flavor text. Game mechanics define what games are, not their visual assets. Illutia and NexusTK have fundamentally identical gameplay mechanics with few differences.

Rogues play like NexusTK Rogues, Mages play like NexusTK Mages, etc and so forth. Illutia was developed with the specific intent to attract the players you claim want to return to NexusTK due to nostalgia for the earlier build, and it failed to do so because -- surprise surprise -- the vast majority of players no longer find those mechanics that enjoyable compared to other MMOs on the market with superior designs. The creators of Illutia, much like yourself, refuse to acknowledge this and instead run the game with the same degree of competency as KRU does. Which is rather ironic when you think about it.


Second of all, the graphical design is nearly identical between the two games, to the point items are drawn on characters the same way. They are both pixel, tile based games. If you place screenshots of the two games side by side, this becomes extremely obvious.





This is no accident, because Illutia was made by former Nexus players wanting to recreate this nostalgic period, just as you do. It's entirely relevant.


QUOTE
How lost are you right now on what former players want? It's not just about the [Content removed]ing game mechanics. It's about playing the same game they used to love. Not an imitation - the same exact game. How is this so hard for you to understand? Like, I get you not wanting it for yourself, but how are you so bad at understanding the thoughts/feelings of others who aren't like you?


The glory day you think existed never did. The period of time you are talking about is when a lot of players were quitting the game. It's clearly not what they wanted, else they would not have left in the first place.

QUOTE
Sigh. The present commercial appeal in the market is a new server and always will be since people aren't stupid and no one wants to start an MMO years behind with no one else near their lvl/stats. This is common sense for me, yet monumentally difficult to understand for you.


And yet people start new characters on new MMOs that have been around for years and have no qualms with leveling up from 1 to whatever-the-level-cap-is. Furthermore, "catching up" with other players is a key motivation for people to play a game, not a reason for them to not.

QUOTE
November's numbers show stagnation. We both know you're smart enough to know this can mean new players filtering in as old players get fed up with Wony's scummy money-grabs. It can also mean returning players coming back, then quickly leaving because it's not the product they wanted. Judging by these reddit posts, that is likely to be what's happening, though it's probably a combination of both.


I completely agree that people are finding the game is not the product they want. Our disagreement is that you think returning the game back to an inferior product state is the solution. There's no evidence whatsoever to support that notion because the fact is people quit the game during this period of time you are speaking of. Not small numbers of people, large numbers of players. They quit NexusTK for other games. This is like what, the fourth time I have reminded you of this? You're completing ignoring this critical fact because it doesn't conform to the narrative you want. Stop doing that. It's an indisputable fact people didn't universally love this version of the game you did.


QUOTE
That's 10 former players in the last two months alone who revisited the game and posted in the subreddit. It sounds like all but one (freshprincetrex) or two (greensky - not sure on this one) of them started from scratch, and many of them mentioned wanting to experience the 1-99 content again. 10 players that required a $0 marketing budget, zero social media outreach, and that number doesn't include potential friends/family or the rest of the nameless/faceless people waiting in the shadows for something to happen. If people are trickling back in without any real news, then the announcement of a new server would surely garner interest. It only needs to appeal to a hundred or so people to be a success based on microscopic variable costs for Kru.


What people say and what they do are two totally different things. Anyone with even a small amount of business sense knows this. I've got mailing lists for pre-launched products and out of the tens of thousands of people who sign up for the list, only about a few hundred might actually sign up for the product when it launches. You're pointing to a handful of former players who say they want something and believing erroneously what they say applies to every other former NexusTK player. It does not.

Whenever I proposed solutions to problems in NexusTK's design, I never relied on what people said they wanted. I instead pointed to exhibited behavior. People aren't quitting NexusTK to play no videogames at all, they are switching to other games with more fun mechanics, better customer service, etc and so forth.

By contrast you're basing your strategy on what people remember about their gameplay when they were 12, and are now in their late 20s. It is the rare game from 1998-2001 that we still find fun in 2016. Even Minecraft is more engaging than NexusTK is.


QUOTE
Or, the farfarfar more likely reason is because they returned hoping to have the same experience they had in high school, but the game is hollow and boring because no one is anywhere near their stats and everything seems different. Tangun is an aberration that they don't remember from their childhood, and no one hunts in Mythic anymore. You have such a strange relationship with this game that it's impossible to get into the shoes of someone who quit in 2006 after going off to college and hasn't registered since. They don't give a [Content removed] about the game being improved, or any of the drama that you've wrapped yourself up in over the years. There were hundreds, if not thousands of people who played the game without ever getting involved in subpath, archon, or clan drama. Those are the people who are coming back, and those are who this new server would be targeted at. It's by far the biggest segment of former players. Everyone in this thread represents the delusional minority who have completely different desires than the avg NTKer of the early '00s.


#1. NexusTK was never the most popular MMO to start with. At it's peak we had like 1,000 active people on the server at once. Then Ragnarok Online, WoW, Dark Ages of Camelot and a bunch of much better designed games came out and most of the playerbase left for those games.

#2. Why would the people who left for those games actively play a game they abandoned due to not being as fun as other games? Games like WoW have remained king by constantly improving their game mechanics, not rolling back to earlier models that people may feel nostalgic for, but ultimately don't enjoy as much as the newer builds. FFXIV has the extreme example where the entire game was totally redesigned practically from scratch because the initial build was failing in the market, and now it's one of the most popular MMOs in the world.


What NexusTK needs is improvements, not roll backs.


QUOTE
Uh, you're posting on nexusforums.com right now. Are you in denial or do you accept that you are just as [Content removed]ed up, if not more, as the people you just [Content removed] on?


I have posted this before, but my primary goal for engaging in these sort of debates is to contribute to the book I am writing on game mechanic design. Due to my intimate familiarity with it, NexusTK serves in the book to provide examples of many bad design concepts and customer service decisions. Engaging in these debates helps remind me of stuff I may have forgotten or allows me to write up stuff I can repurpose as sections of the book. This forum is just one of a dozen places I regular read and post to.

There is a method to what you may believe is madness.

QUOTE
I promise you 100% that NTK existed in the early '00s and I did play it. Are you drunk?


The game existed; the version of the game you recall did not. That is the point I am making. You have rose colored glasses on about the actual state of NexusTK in the past.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121514 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 10 2016, 03:17 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 9 2016, 10:01 PM) *
The "Game FAQ" button on the Illutia website is broken. Also, "exactly the old school NexusTK experience" I want is not a completely different game. What the actual [Content removed]?


Indeed. You seem to think a half-assed excuse like part of the website being broken is an excuse for not downloading the client and checking the game out to verify what I am saying. Or, you know, at least looking at some YouTube videos. Rather you want to discard the existence of Illutia, which is pretty much what you are arguing for in terms of game mechanics. But now we get to the heart of what you're really after; you want to play a rolled back version of NexusTK from when you first registered an account and personally re-live what you recall as its glory days. You do not actually care about its present commercial appeal in the market, and you just want to personally re-live that period of time from your life.

Well, sorry but that's profoundly nonsensical for so many reasons, as we are about to get into.

QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 9 2016, 10:01 PM) *
We're fixating on the wrong things here. Former players who are coming back to the game are creating new heroes, not restoring old ones. It's not even an option right now. >90% of these players will prefer to start out on even footing (or close to it), on a server with a fresh, non-broken economy. All I am personally looking for is a blank slate with the same quests I remember, the same carnages, bloodlusts, elixir wars, fox hunts, the same caves, the same crafting, the same handful of maps. None of you are really making it sound like this is difficult to pull off, which makes sense because I'm simply asking for rehashed content. The request is supposed to be simple because I try to stay firmly planted in reality. Wony just isn't going to implement all the changes you guys want.


"Former players who are coming back"? Your own data indicates this isn't a true statement. Nobody is coming back.

Maybe people log onto a newbie because they get nostalgic and just want to check out the game for abit, or even go to re-reg an old account. But then they quickly recall the reasons why they left in the first place and they leave. It isn't because some people have millions more vita than they do or because people do not sit AFK in Mythic Vale occasionally saging for a party or an item they are selling. They leave because the game is not as fun as other MMOs. It offers nothing of substantial improvement in any particular area. A lot of the people still actively playing are addicts who have serious problems in their personal lives and are avoiding reality for the feeling of elitism, power and community they get from playing the same online game for the past two decades of their life. It isn't healthy and it's certainly not an indicator that a new server is what they want. It is actually rather tragic because out of the nigh infinite number of things they could be doing with their lives, they decided to invest their time and money into a [Content removed] game made by a company that doesn't care about them. And somehow in all of this, you think a new server with features you are personally nostalgic for will be a grand hit?

Nostalgia can be a powerful thing but looking at the past with rose-colored glasses makes for a terrible business plan. The game had humongous problems even in its heyday which is why it was the LEAST MOST POPULAR MMO AT THE TIME WHEN THERE WAS ONLY A HANDFUL OF MMOs.. Ultima Online, Everquest, and Lineage had way more players. Hell, the original Baram in Korea was vastly more popular than NexusTK ever was, because NexusTK was horribly managed from day 1. There was a period of three years where the game introduced absolutely no new content, and just recycled the same seasonal events with little to no changes whatsoever. We once went an entire year with no GM. This is not some spectacular design that everyone universally loved and appreciated. A lot of older players stuck around primarily because of the friendships they formed with people and not because the game was that fun to play. As newer, significantly better designed and managed MMOs came out, the playerbase gradually left for those.

You can invent any kind of idea you like for why the game was never popular but I played the game for a substantial number of years during this heyday period you speak of. I even recall the full page PC Gamer ad that Nexon took out and included a CD download of the game client. We got an influx of newbies for a few weeks, and then it petered out after about a month, because people just did not enjoy the crappy mechanics and limited gameplay compared to other MMOs that were out at the time. That is just the blunt truth. The game had problems and under Wony's management, they never got addressed because he hires people totally unqualified to be GMs of an MMO to run his games.

Frankly, there is not that many people who want to roll back the clock on a [Content removed]ty game to a point in time where it was even [Content removed]tier than it is now. The game needs its current issues resolved so that it can become popular enough for a second server. Right now it isn't even popular enough for one server.

I swear, NexusTK and City of Heroes have some of the most anal die-hard fanboys of any MMOs out there, who even when faced with the blunt truth reality that their most favorite game in the universe actually had critical flaws that led to their decline, they just refuse to accept it because they found something within that period of their life they can't let go of, and it has nothing -- absolutely nothing at all -- to do with the way they game mechanics were, and everything to do with the personal importance they placed into the game at a [Content removed]ty period of their life. That is the only way I can rationalize the obsession with remembering terrible game mechanic choices as some kind of thing everyone universally loved and that if only the game would be back to its former crappy state, everything would be right in the world.

You got to get over it, man. The version of NexusTK you want to play never really existed to begin with and the reason people can universally disagree with your ideas is because we all lived through this version of the game you are talking about, and we remember how it actually was rather than how you recall it to have been.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121509 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 9 2016, 07:30 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 8 2016, 11:46 PM) *
@DM "Go look at Illutia, which is pretty much exactly what you are thinking." Err, I'd look at it but their Game FAQ is just a broken link. Gunna go ahead and assume your comparison is lacking.


Your first impulse was to go to GameFAQs rather than just Googling its website?

Illutia is a perfect comparison because the game was originally made by Inkey, a Nexus player who wanted exactly the old school NexusTK experience you are wanting.

  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121507 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 8 2016, 09:17 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 6 2016, 09:59 AM) *
Yes. Don't you have special insight into this? Please elaborate if so - that would be the easiest way to shut me up. Maybe DM can weigh in. Last I checked, copy+paste was a thing in computing. Also, the delete key is a thing. Dev presses delete until only pre-Vortex caves remain, delete overflow, delete Woodlands, delete Nagnang, delete Tangun, control+c, control+v, and voila! New, retro server. It's not like you're reinventing the wheel - the code is already there. I'm guessing it would take a single person one month to do this project once they understand how everything works. A year from now, the new devs Wony hired this year should be familiar enough to pull it off, no? Maybe tack on another month for Wony to set up CRM stuff, prep kruna shop, etc. The problem with asking for new content is that it's not easy to dream up new, solid content. It's far easier to reuse content that's already been built. No creativity necessary.


Hypothetically? Maybe.

Realistically? I doubt it. I wouldn't be surprised to learn one of the core problems with NexusTK has been years of low paid programmers using all kinds of shortcuts and tricks, with code referencing some other code buried deeply in some obscure file. And there may or may not actually be any detailed documentation about what code does what. I mean, supposedly they "lost" the code to some event enemies like Zibongs. It's probably not lost, it's just buried on the server somewhere because Grin decided he would have job security if he was the only one who could understand his code.

This is just speculation, of course. But I don't know why anyone would want to delete decades of content that they have been paying for people to develop, unless it really hurts the game, which sure some of it does but only because it needs a few tweaks to correct the problem. So sure they could start deleting stuff but I suspect they would need to do a lot of bug testing to find all the [Content removed] that breaks when they start deleting stuff.

There is a difference between fixing a few leaky pipes in your house, and throwing your entire plumbing system out to replace it. And right now the analogy would be to replace all of the leaking PVC pipes with corroded rusty ones.

Also, Hijack would probably just take the server code the NexusTK clones are using and develop a stand alone client for it -- which honestly, that's what all these people making emulators should have done to begin with.

I will save you some time though. Go look at Illutia, which is pretty much exactly what you are thinking. Go see how poorly that game is doing and then re-evaluate whether this is really as amazing of a commercial idea as you think it is.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121501 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 4 2016, 11:57 PM


Oh san
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I do not disagree with your conclusion that Nexus is stagnating but your solution I don't think will work.

QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 3 2016, 02:16 PM) *
"Kru doesn't want that. Wony doesn't want that."

First off, Kru and Wony have one priority: USD.


This is true, but Wony's opinion on the best way to make money is not in line with anyone else's.

Wony has always operated this game with the intent to spend as little money as possible running the game while trying to milk the playerbase through item shop sales.

I hoped that would have changed when he started posting directly, but it seems obvious that KRU will not be making any substantial changes to its business model.

QUOTE
Second, Wony himself said that my idea was interesting, just not something he wanted to pursue at this time (August '16).


That was just a nice way of saying he has no intentions to do it.


I also don't understand the obsession with a so-called "retro server" but the problems with this have been debated to death I think. They really need to fix the current server's gameplay problems before making a new server.

QUOTE (halombobtk @ Dec 3 2016, 01:51 PM) *
Conro's posts are always going to be derailing because he has far higher standards for this game than the average former player. He knows its failings intricately and is an intelligent/analytical dude. The 2k+ target market of former players and their fam/friends, on average, are not as smart as Conro or anyone else in this thread except Krmit (lol). At the end of one year, only ~66 of them still need to be actively playing on the new server to make it a worthwhile endeavor. That would double the current number of active users and be a nice boost in revenue for Kru with microscopic variable costs. The license, AWS, building, devs, etc. are already paid for. I doubt they'd even need to hire someone new to build/maintain it, as they could simply dial back all the useless updates we've seen so far on the existing server. After launch, maintenance would be minimal. With retro pacing and maps, there is more than enough content to churn through for 1-3k hours with everyone starting new. Grinding to 99 would take ages compared to how it is now, and people would be making multiple characters to max Glory/Legends/Ancients. Mounts, crafting bags, and misc. kruna for every character would be more than enough to justify the project, even if it died after a couple years.


Firstly, Conro's post aren't really derailing if he's just pointing out a differing point of view.

Secondly, Conro is not the only former player who has actually played other MMOs. If you play one MMO, you probably play others, too. The observations Conro has made can be made by anyone who has played any other MMO besides Nexus, especially any made in the past decade.

Thirdly, I think you are severely over-estimating how many people will actually pay $10 a month to play NexusTK circa 1999-2001. Part of the nostalgia was the people who were active at the time, and those still interested in MMOs are not going to be dumping WoW and FFXIV for a game where one or two buttons represents the vast majority of gameplay for each class, whether it is holding spacebar for Warriors, Ambush + Invis for Rogues, zaps for Mages and healspam for Poets. There is this mechanic called rotations which WoW introduced 12 years ago that almost everyone agrees was a novel improvement to the point every MMO does it now. Old-school Nexus gameplay just is not that compelling, and what people remember are more the players they played with rather than their absolute love of mashing the same button for five hours a night while they killed farm animals that respawned in one room.

If you want to spend money into proving me wrong, by all means make a clone of NexusTK circa 1999. It's not terribly difficult to do these days with all the software available and pixel tileset resources floating around the net for reasonable licenses. It doesn't have to look exactly like Nexus to be Nexus, and if people really want the gameplay they will come play it as you say. But I rather doubt it since will judge it against other MMOs. We know how well these mechanics will work out, because Nexus already did it. Even when there was only Ultima Online to compete with in the NA market, people overwhelmingly did not choose to play NexusTK, and as games like Everquest, Ragnarok Online, Dark Ages of Camelot and WoW came out people went to those games instead.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121474 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 4 2016, 11:43 PM


Oh san
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Ah for some reason images didnt load for me the first time.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121473 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Dec 3 2016, 10:18 PM


Oh san
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Was there supposed to be a link in your post? I'm not sure what data you are referencing.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121471 · Replies: 101 · Views: 12,743

darkmaverick
Posted on: Oct 31 2016, 03:54 PM


Oh san
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This is one of the problems with wikis. Rather than curate their own information, KRU opted for the lazy approach of having players make the contributions to their guide. Unfortunately players are just as lazy as the GMs are, so they opt to just copy and paste information rather than make the effort of producing their own accounts.

The other problem with a wiki approach is that it's a free for all model. It's impossible to establish reliability if you don't know who the author is and cannot verify their credentials. The information on NA is viewed as credible because players know who is responsible for recording it and trust these people to make accurate reports, because if they don't they lose positive reputation within the community. With a wiki approach, the credibility of KRU is inherited by the anonymous contributors which means dubious information can appear credible to those who don't know any better. It's not the way I would have done a newbie guide and I suspect a lot of misinformation is going to work its way into it which will create a negative perception of KRU in new players -- not that it needs any help in this.

Anyway, I think it would have done the GMs some good to create their own guide, because then it would have forced them to actually learn how the game works and benefited future design of content.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121431 · Replies: 13 · Views: 2,507

darkmaverick
Posted on: Oct 31 2016, 12:34 PM


Oh san
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While your post was snarky, Tangun was really about the abusive peasants, which is partly why it was overdone. I never thought abusive peasants was that critical of an issue myself and could have been addressed in other ways.

I do think some kind of streamlined tutorial was needed for NexusTK, but Tangun went a little overboard with it. It's not the reason the game started going downhill but it contributed to the decline of the influx of new players.

Vini is not entirely wrong in his view that NA content shouldn't just be copy pasted onto another website without permission from NA. To argue the information has no owner is just factually incorrect, and NA has some rights to information that was created and posted for it. Information isn't copyright-able, but the specific expression of information is. The information on NA falls under copyright protection by virtue of the fact people created information to post on it, and I suspect there is some kind of agreement contributors make that they give NA some rights to the content they post here, similar to the shrink wrap agreement we all agree to when we register on this forum. At the bare minimum there is at least a compelling argument to be made that the intent of contributors is to give copyright ownership of their submissions to NexusAtlas given they submit knowing the site footer says all portions of the site are copyrighted by NA.

As a similar example, if I write a guide to some game like Castlevania and upload it to GameFAQs that doesn't give Konami permission to copy my guide ad verbatim and post it to their website. This same scenario applies to NexusTK and KRU. The specific expression of information is copyright-able, even if it's about something else that is copyrightable. As the copyright holder I have the right to determine who has a license to display and reproduce it.

The semantical argument about the spirit of community and whatnot isn't based on facts surrounding copyright law. It's not rational to want new interpretations of copyright law just to justify your opinion on a certain matter like this.

The question of KRU's ownership of NexusTK and its relation to guides made by third parties isn't so much as a copyright issue, but rather a licensing issue. Do people need a license in order to create a guide, which is basically a derivative work? The answer is no, firstly because guides are an example of acceptable fair usage per Section 107 of the Copyright Act and secondly because KRU does not make any money from licensing strategy guides based on NexusTK. The only way in which KRU could successfully demonstrate damages due to a non-licensed derivative work that normally falls within fair use parameters is if this usage deprived them of revenue and without having previously licensed a strategy guide they can't even begin to make such an argument.

Now, Vini as admin could choose to allow the info to be posted into this wiki guide thing, but doing so is against the interests of Nexus Atlas. The site's primary value is as a source of this information. It'd be like if Encyclopedia Britannica intentionally allowed all their information to be posted ad verbatim to Wikipedia.

Normally this issue would have some financial interest against the information being freely posted elsewhere, but since NA people have always refused to put ads on the site and instead run it like martyrs, I think it is likely that it's really just the fiefdom trespassing that Vini is upset about. Being involved with NA awards a social status, which is based on the popularity and usefulness of the site to the playerbase. If the value is diminished due to this new competitor then that social status is now being threatened. The social status of being a NA contributor is not without merit (it is awarded because NA is useful to the community) but this status only remains so long as the site is providing the same value.

In any case the decision to not run ads on NexusAtlas gives NA few legal options to enforce its copyright against KRU just copying everything to their wiki. Similar to how not licensing strategy guides makes it pretty much impossible for KRU to make a compelling argument that it loses money from non-licensed strategy guides, Nexus Atlas has a difficult time demonstrating how it is damaged from theft of its copyrighted material because it produces no revenue from the material. The legal system is built to benefit capitalism; if you adopt socialist policies it's difficult to use the law to assist you in civil matters. ( There's a few notable examples of socialist minded people getting screwed by the system; Google 'Carol Highsmith Vs. Getty Images' for a recent one).

tl:dr

1. NexusAtlas has the right to restrict usage of its copyrighted works.

2. NexusAtlas will probably never be able to enforce these restrictions because they can't prove any financial damages since they don't make money from the copyrighted work and KRU isn't making a profit from their wiki guide either.

3. Asking people to be nice and respectful is about all NexusAtlas can do. We all know how well that is going to turn out.

QUOTE
surprisingly savvy business discourse from a dude who got fat making YouTube videos and.. retired? I dunno.


I take it this is aimed at me.

You've confused founding and selling a YouTube MCN with just "making videos". Sure, I've made videos but that is like saying Walt Disney just made theatrical cartoon shorts and ignoring that's not really how his company made its money (merchandising licensing is what built the Walt Disney Company).

The "savvy business discourse" you see from me comes from the experience of making savvy business decisions. Not really critical to the discussion but just wanted to clear that up.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121428 · Replies: 13 · Views: 2,507

darkmaverick
Posted on: Oct 27 2016, 07:32 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (halombobtk @ Oct 26 2016, 12:56 AM) *
I've checked every day at peak times, and the Halloween event has yet to crack 400 logged players (though it has gotten close). See my above post about active vs. afk numbers if you plan on taking the time to respond.


KRU honestly thought people want to do a complex fetch quest for a break on death shield with no stats.

I'll stick with FFXIV, thanks.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121422 · Replies: 38 · Views: 4,816

darkmaverick
Posted on: Oct 19 2016, 10:47 PM


Oh san
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Anyone considering playing this game need only look at the newest official "event" the people in charge thought would be compelling.

There was a "roleplaying event" where a bunch of adult players decided to roleplay as "royal children" and have a "playdate picnic". This has to be the most bizarre use of event characters I've ever seen.

The lunatics are running the asylum. Don't bother.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121415 · Replies: 38 · Views: 4,816

darkmaverick
Posted on: Oct 10 2016, 06:12 PM


Oh san
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NexusTK should go on Steam Greenlight but if it goes on right now it will get downvoted to oblivion because anyone who tries it will be hella bored.

KRU needs to address the game problems for newbies first. They haven't done it, and my guess is they will not because it would require too much energy and KRU just wants to make a quick buck with the least amount of effort.

The game has a shelf life, and it's tied to the lifespans of the people still obsessed with it and have been playing for two decades. Once enough of these people die the game will close.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121392 · Replies: 38 · Views: 4,816

darkmaverick
Posted on: Oct 10 2016, 05:30 AM


Oh san
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NexusTK does have community management problems, but it stems from a lack of understanding of development. If the developers neither understand nor appreciate the players that is going to impact the instructions given to community managers like Archons.

  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121390 · Replies: 38 · Views: 4,816

darkmaverick
Posted on: Oct 8 2016, 05:50 PM


Oh san
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I bet you anything this is a sign of the current financial state of KRU.

Good thing my old credit card I used for this game has long since expired.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121382 · Replies: 19 · Views: 2,347

darkmaverick
Posted on: Oct 8 2016, 05:44 PM


Oh san
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QUOTE (Monomaxos @ Oct 8 2016, 02:41 PM) *
I see, is Chongun good though?


I may not be the most ideal person to answer this question for a new player since my opinion will be extremely bias based on my history with that path.

I will say this; if you're going to spend $10 a month playing an MMO, your money will not be well spent on NexusTK. All your time and money will just end up in disappointment. If I re-regged right now my Warrior I'm fairly sure my character would be in the top 40 warriors in the game in terms of stats, and you couldn't pay me to come back to this game with the way it is right now.

QUOTE
he same company mismanaged and closed another good game in Zero Online - The most important thing? They never announced it was closing down. They just left it unmanaged around a year(not even server reboots and forums were full of commercial bots posts after a while) till it went offline. You do understand why I mention there are far worse companies than KRU? lol


KRU is making token gesture updates to NexusTK right now. Prior to this the game was basically ignored for years. Periodically they made a small update, like adding an item or two, or making a seasonal event to dump overpowered items into the game market, but for the most part the game has not truly had its mechanics updated in a good decade.

I can honestly not think of another MMO which is less newbie friendly than NexusTK. Early level gaming is boring and you have to make friends to progress at any decent pace, and because the game is boring it has few new players willing to stick around.
  Forum: Community Board · Post Preview: #121381 · Replies: 38 · Views: 4,816

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