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> Dmg Over Hit, Which is better
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post Jul 30 2006, 12:11 PM
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Okay.. so I wanted to know which is better to have more of Damage, or hit, for hunting. smile.gif
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AceoStar
post Jul 30 2006, 12:24 PM
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This is a subject I've looked into a lot, but havent come up with any concrete evidence as to which is actually better. But I think most people believe Dam is king, but w/ no hit there is a noticable difference.

We know the formula for DAM for increasing damage done, but I dont think we have one for hit.

What needs to be discovered is how much more often HIT makes you connect, and then find out if it makes you connect so much more often, that it would outweigh the damage increase.

I believe DM and others have the values for DAM


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Henry
post Jul 30 2006, 02:46 PM
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They're both important with DAM being slightly more important. However, Hit isn't completely useless, far from it. To test this, go to a cunning a bandit3 with a rogue using ALAs and then one with him using ACs. Unless some other group member creates a few probelms the AC cun will bring in 100-200m more exp.
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LEET
post Jul 30 2006, 04:04 PM
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I prefer hit that is why I like claws...

So you can hit side of sets more

also i remember when people said hit makes you attack faster

*laughs*
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Aaron
post Jul 30 2006, 05:14 PM
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It depends on who you are.

Being a PC Rogue, I look for Dam, because I'm weak enough as it already is (maybe that'll change soon... *crosses fingers*). With enough Dam, I can hit about the same as a cunning 3.5 or a cunning 4.


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AceoStar
post Jul 30 2006, 05:30 PM
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QUOTE
also i remember when people said hit makes you attack faster


If hit makes you connect one time more out of every 10 swings I guess it sorta is making you attack faster.
But I guess more accurate would be attacking more often


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Rachel
post Jul 30 2006, 06:11 PM
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I've tested this every now and again. It should be true unless kru changed something.


For all comparisons, bonuses of vita, mana, grace, and might are not considered. When deciding what to wear, these can make a big difference.


Most people either have magical dusts, wind armors, or black boots and flutes to start off and give them at least 3 hit and 3 dam. (This figure is a bit low for most fighters, but we'll go with it)

So before hand items, you would have this much with each weapon:
Blood - 3 hit, 9 dam
Nimble - 7 hit, 6 dam
Scale - 6 hit, 6 dam
Spike - -2hit, 8 dam

If you have the choice of 10 hit, 0 dam vs 0 hit, 10 dam from this point, dam would be clearly better but it wouldn't be too significant. The third choice of 5 hit, 5 dam would be worse than both of the previous options.

It matters a lot more when it comes to polearms though, since they have trouble hitting the spots diagonal from you.


For warriors it's pretty easy if you don't have much money. 2 ambrosias will give you 10 hit, 10 dam.

WBC/OBC/ABC would probably be better with their 20 hit, 22 hit, and 24 hit. (I never noticed how much hit they gave and would like to see this tested)

WC/OC/AC are obviously better with more than 10 hit and 10 dam.

OLA/ALA may be a better with 16 dam and 18 dam.

WDH could be better or worse with 16hit, 8dam

ODH/ADH would be better with 18 hit, 10 dam and 20 hit, 12 dam

AMH is of course better with 12 hit and 10 dam



When it comes to rogues, ambrosias are out. It will get confusing since there are so many more items to look at. Tell me your path, stats/rank, and how much money you have and I'll give you a better idea.


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solman
post Jul 30 2006, 08:47 PM
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This is a simple solution.. Damage over Hit clearly if your talking PK situations pre 99er. Polearm wise hit over damage.

How hard you hit something vs how often you connect. I will choose hitting harder PK wise because you don't have as long to take somebody out. More often then not you only get 2 or 3 swings at best. Id rather do the most damage possible.


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AceoStar
post Jul 30 2006, 09:45 PM
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What's your take on this DM?


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NIKE
post Jul 31 2006, 09:18 AM
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i actually think it depends on who your mage is too.. if we're talking about hunts that is.

if you have a mage that does set pretty well, you'd want hit+dam so that youre able to hit everything well. but if youre hunting with a mage that maybe doesnt set so well, dam would be your option so that you hit whatever youre facing hard

imho


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Mirado
post Jul 31 2006, 07:46 PM
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God I love how dumbed-down WoW's item bonuses are.

They're easy as hell.

The item will say on it right there "Adds 1% to critical", "Adds 1% to hit", blah blah.
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Poet
post Aug 1 2006, 09:38 AM
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Well, Let me just state this:
Lepetitchou in Bandit3 can bring in 1b-1.1b / rage with ABC(all hit, no dam)
This is about the same exp as any other fighter I can poet in Bandit3. Keep in mind, i'm only an Ee san poet, that is why the exp sucks.

What was noticable the most was how often he hit EVERY monster. His rage6 seemed like a rage5.5, but it seemed to make up for itself by how often he hit on ALL rages.
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AceoStar
post Aug 1 2006, 10:07 AM
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Anyone rich have 2 AC and 2 ADH to post some benchmarks?


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Bobert
post Aug 1 2006, 11:06 AM
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I believe dmg actually increases what you do (based off of the damage formula), and hit is more accuracy. with zero i miss here and there (naked basically), then when i raise it, i miss less and less.

fully dressed (PA, wind, 2 corrs, 2 black firm boots, magical dust) to hunt, im 10 hit and 10 dam.

Based off of the formula, i do roughly 14208.75 on C4.


Hit is not on the formula, therefore, what ive gotten from higher hit, better accuracy.


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lepetitchou
post Aug 1 2006, 01:03 PM
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QUOTE(AceoStar @ Aug 1 2006, 11:07 AM) [snapback]5630[/snapback]

Anyone rich have 2 AC and 2 ADH to post some benchmarks?


I had SinJackal test ODH versus OC and he found a 40-50m exp difference per rage in bandit 3. Considering he can one hit these monsters, the difference may be greater for smaller rogues.
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Henry
post Aug 1 2006, 01:57 PM
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Which did better LPC? THe OC or ODH.
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LEET
post Aug 1 2006, 05:45 PM
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QUOTE(Poet @ Aug 1 2006, 09:38 AM) [snapback]5622[/snapback]

Well, Let me just state this:
Lepetitchou in Bandit3 can bring in 1b-1.1b / rage with ABC(all hit, no dam)
This is about the same exp as any other fighter I can poet in Bandit3. Keep in mind, i'm only an Ee san poet, that is why the exp sucks.

What was noticable the most was how often he hit EVERY monster. His rage6 seemed like a rage5.5, but it seemed to make up for itself by how often he hit on ALL rages.


I know a rogue with Old claws a ee poet and ee mage that got 1b cunning in bandit2.
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PureLight
post Aug 1 2006, 06:05 PM
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On a rogue Dam over hit, because Hit doesnt matter(much) on c1 so killing faster for that section of your hunt will end up increasing the ammount of damage you deal. With Warriors Hit over dam because you always have to worry about having flank and backstab hitting. I have an NLA pair and do pretty well. With warriors ALWAYS use Amros until il. Just swing wise Ambros pair>New Claw pair.


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lepetitchou
post Aug 3 2006, 08:11 AM
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Sorry - OC pair did better.
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PureLight
post Aug 3 2006, 08:46 AM
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I have no experience with il+ hand items but for a sub il warrior Ambrosia>New Claws

This is ambrosia:
AC: -10
Hit: +5
Dam: +5
Vita: 500 Mana: 0
Might: +8 Will: 0 Grace: +2
Protection: +2 Healing: 0
Regen: 0
Warrior Level: 55

This is new claw:
AC: -8
Hit: 4
Dam: 4
Vita: 4000 Mana: 0
Might: 3 Will: 0 Grace: 0
Protection: 0 Healing: 3
Peasant Level: 99

Ambrosia are so much better than New claws. It is a waste to buy Vortex hand items as a 99 warrior..


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