IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

13 Pages V   1 2 3 > »   
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Carnage Hosts
Rubi
post Nov 1 2006, 02:27 PM
Post #1


Level 99
**

Group: Citizens
Posts: 65
Joined: 7-August 06
Member No.: 572



So why is it that as of the new hirings, at least 3 of our oh so loved carnage hosts are bought accounts?


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Genica
post Nov 1 2006, 02:30 PM
Post #2


Ee san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 478
Joined: 5-July 06
Member No.: 143
Characters: Genica



Who are the new hires as carnage hosts?


--------------------
Friendship is like peeing your pants, everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Tynan
post Nov 1 2006, 02:33 PM
Post #3


Ee san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 506
Joined: 3-July 06
From: British Columbia, Canada
Member No.: 12



An equally valid question is, 'Why are so many qualified applicants turned down?'

I'd like to know the answers to both of these questions, myself, having known many good people wishing to become hosts get denied, people with a lot of PK experience and knowledge of the players and the game.

What really bothers me is seeing this and then seeing events get delayed or canceled because the host fails to show or shows up late.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Falaris
post Nov 1 2006, 03:01 PM
Post #4


Oh san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 5,152
Joined: 3-July 06
Member No.: 46
Characters: Falaris, everclear



QUOTE(Tynan @ Nov 1 2006, 01:33 PM) [snapback]15913[/snapback]

An equally valid question is, 'Why are so many qualified applicants turned down?'

I'd like to know the answers to both of these questions, myself, having known many good people wishing to become hosts get denied, people with a lot of PK experience and knowledge of the players and the game.


Most are not so qualified, and it is hard when it comes to the trust you have to place in a person who hosts. I am all for hiring people to see how they pan out (because the newbie host powers basically limit you to warping in and out of the halls, and getting summer dye, thats it), but many don't even show up to help out at the carnages they are scheduled for as new hires. Finding good hosts is not an easy task. Real life availability is also a key.

While there have been notable exceptions to my next statement (namely, Chica), why are most hosts in subpaths, hold positions in clans, or are involved in some other organization? Because they have already proven themselves in some small way dependent on how deeply they got involved in that path. If you had your choice of "Subpath Guide A" or "Ee san Mage B," with the first holding his position for some time with no problems, and the Ee san mage having more carnage experience but not in any kind of 'position of power,' which are you going to pick? Honestly, Subpath Guide A. Why? It isn't a matter of how much more he'll have to know about carnages and go through training, its that there is less of a chance that he would rig carnages or steal prizes or dye friends afterwards and let them go through the doors for Sam san because he would have a lot more to lose.

This is not to say Ee san Mage B could not become a carnage host, as I said some people have gotten into carnage hosting and done well at it without much in way of responsibilities in other organizations (another one that comes to mind is ClockMage).

You might say "Well this is why hosts are so terrible at teams." Ok, would you rather know the host honestly just screwed up thinking they were making teams the best they could, or question that the host rigged the carnage outright? And moreover, there are many hosts who ARE good that are subpath members and not huge into hunting or playing in carnages for that matter. Before I left hosting this last time around, I managed something like 2 months of hosting Bloodlusts and only 1 of the ones I hosted didn't go three rounds. I have always stated 3 rounds isn't THE metric that defines a good carnage or not, but at the very least you have to appreciate those kinds of statistics. Some of the most popular and famous hosts were also in positions like I've been in. Look at Worldwalker, who was a Shaman guide.

Another reason might be actions in and around carnages of the people who are turned down. People who PK a lot also get very upset and might lash out at hosts when they lose. Why would the carnage hosting team want to hire you if you've slammed them on comm before or have made trouble in even just 1-2 carnages?

There is more to it than just "goes to carnages a lot." And blatantly, I can name off numerous good hosts who didn't attend many carnages but balance very well, and numerous Sam sans who are terrible at it. I'm not going to name names, but it takes a certain kind of ability to think about teams in your mind and have players "cancel out" one another so that no team has a clear advantage. You have to be able to think about quite a lot of data, such as who works with who, how much that increases their skill by working together (an obvious example of a duo like this is Jubai and Cristiana), who won't work with who because they hate one another, who has a good track record against who, etc., and then apply it not to just those two people (or more) you are considering matching together or against one another, but how that will also effect the entire teams that you are placing them on. I am not suggesting hosts sit there and crunch numbers as they balance, but you'd be surprised that when you first see that list of names and are told "Go, balance them" how much harder it is then you thought.

I think every host can attest to the first time it was solely on them, even after being an assistant and watching other hosts do it, that it was unnerving at the least if not downright scary to know you now have 100 people who you could either have love you for a fun carnage, or hate you for messing up something so small as even having 1 top on the wrong team to throw your balance off. This is off topic, but these are also character traits you might want to look for in a host: Thick skin and determination.


-Falaris


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Genica
post Nov 1 2006, 03:37 PM
Post #5


Ee san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 478
Joined: 5-July 06
Member No.: 143
Characters: Genica



If you will notice the people who hang out together and hunt together in the game and who spends time on the same vent server, then your question will be answered about how carnage hosts are picked!! tongue.gif


--------------------
Friendship is like peeing your pants, everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Forum Troll
post Nov 1 2006, 03:49 PM
Post #6


Il san
Group Icon

Group: Citizens
Posts: 191
Joined: 3-July 06
Member No.: 52



Falaris while I agree with your post I really have to disagree. Most of the reason people get picked or not picked is because the hosts all vote on the applicants and if they see their friend up there they will vote. The only reason I wasn't picked for carnage host was because MotsuSasou had a personal grudge against me for something I said to her in an elixir and she said pretty much "if he joins, I quit".

And it's really sad because I can make almost every single carnage, be there on time, and do what I need to do, all while we have people like (week1) Three not showing up, (week2) AzNAngelz not scheduling someone, and (week3) AzNAngelz scheduling herself and letting mals host it on her character (noon tuesday carnage). Every single time I was there early to the doors.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Coolboyman
post Nov 1 2006, 03:55 PM
Post #7


Sam san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 796
Joined: 4-July 06
Member No.: 65



QUOTE(Genica @ Nov 1 2006, 03:37 PM) [snapback]15927[/snapback]

If you will notice the people who hang out together and hunt together in the game and who spends time on the same vent server, then your question will be answered about how carnage hosts are picked!! tongue.gif


Not true. I wasnt friends with 90% hosts when I was hired, I dont even use vent. I just sent in an application, they interviewed me, thought I would be a good host, and made me a host. I made friends with these people AFTER I was a host.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Forum Troll
post Nov 1 2006, 03:56 PM
Post #8


Il san
Group Icon

Group: Citizens
Posts: 191
Joined: 3-July 06
Member No.: 52



QUOTE(Coolboyman @ Nov 1 2006, 04:55 PM) [snapback]15930[/snapback]

Not true. I wasnt friends with 90% hosts when I was hired, I dont even use vent. I just sent in an application, they interviewed me, thought I would be a good host, and made me a host. I made friends with these people AFTER I was a host.


Who was the head host at the time? Not dethsgift. Point made. You got lucky.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Tynan
post Nov 1 2006, 04:29 PM
Post #9


Ee san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 506
Joined: 3-July 06
From: British Columbia, Canada
Member No.: 12



I agree with you on your points, Falaris, and you seem to agree that people who at least appear qualified should be given a chance. I grant that people in subpaths are likely to be more trustworthy; however, not accepting a seemingly great applicant on the basis that he or she might not be trustworthy is akin to assuming someone is guilty before being proven innocent. Too many head hosts seem to do this, or, as Genica said, they pick friends.

Oh, and as for thick skin - definitely. MickeyLady wrote the book on this, I think. She takes far more flak than any other host in the history of carnages and yet never seems to get rattled. It is quite amazing, really. If I was bashed every single time I hosted, I am not sure I could keep it up, and I am fairly good about taking criticism.

P.S. I am glad, looking, that I was denied when I applied years ago. At the time I thought I'd enjoy it, and I will not lie and say I was not disappointed, but eventually I realized I have a lot more fun participating in things than running things. I think this is the conclusion quite a few hosts reach after being accepted.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Falaris
post Nov 1 2006, 04:49 PM
Post #10


Oh san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 5,152
Joined: 3-July 06
Member No.: 46
Characters: Falaris, everclear



QUOTE(Tynan @ Nov 1 2006, 03:29 PM) [snapback]15934[/snapback]

I agree with you on your points, Falaris, and you seem to agree that people who at least appear qualified should be given a chance. I grant that people in subpaths are likely to be more trustworthy; however, not accepting a seemingly great applicant on the basis that he or she might not be trustworthy is akin to assuming someone is guilty before being proven innocent. Too many head hosts seem to do this, or, as Genica said, they pick friends.


Oh, I agree, the problem is many are proven guilty already. Sadly, many others who just "seem" it are left out as well, and during the phase when hosts were invited to Ahalya's times of whispering people and bringing them in to let the hosts grill them and see who would be chosen as new hosts, I stuck up for quite a few people to give them a shot and got upset with the other hosts who would count them out not because of their actual answers but rather just because they "didn't like them." I don't mean that like they personally didn't like them, rather they just got a "bad vibe" about them.

Most if not all of the time, those people didn't pan out, but like I said, it is worth giving someone at least a shot with the level 1 powers.

The other issue is that carnage hosts are generally friendly with one another. Especially those who do it a lot, or at least in certain divisions (Bloodlust hosts have a ton of pride and stick together, for example). So now, lets throw a host that those people hate and have heated wars with in Sire into the mix. That person is going to be left out, and have a much harder if not impossible time moving up to being a full host. This isn't how carnage is, this is how HUMANITY is. Is there favoritism? YES. Is it as bad as most make it out to be? NO. But some common sense has to prevail here too. If you want my honest opinion, if you have someone who is in the group that 'fights with' the group that mainly runs carnages, they are going to be in for a rough time. It really probably isn't even worth it for them to try to host.

I am not trying to say the people who did and do currently run carnages are corrupt. What I am saying is you can shout to you are blue in the face, but in the end you aren't going to change how the world, not just carnages, works. Similarly, why not pick friends, people who you think you can trust, and are on good terms with already? Again, this is how the world works. It isn't just carnages in Nexus either, it is subpaths, clans, ministries, everything. Some do get in who aren't friends with any hosts, or make it based on their own determination and hard work, but it really is who you know, not what you know. I couldn't have made it so far in Merchants had I not made friends with so many Merchants. Work ethic played a part, sure, but in the end had I not gotten on the good side of enough Merchants I would have never made it in.


-Falaris


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Hatiki
post Nov 1 2006, 06:09 PM
Post #11


General of Koguryo Army
Group Icon

Group: Retired Staff
Posts: 586
Joined: 25-July 06
From: Vancouver, BC
Member No.: 491
Characters: Hatiki



QUOTE(Forum Troll @ Nov 1 2006, 01:56 PM) [snapback]15931[/snapback]

Who was the head host at the time? Not dethsgift. Point made. You got lucky.


I'm not friends with any of these hosts, minus AznAngelz. I don't have vent and I hate hunting and I was just hired.


--------------------
"Conspiracy, scandals, truths and slight truths."
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rubi
post Nov 1 2006, 08:11 PM
Post #12


Level 99
**

Group: Citizens
Posts: 65
Joined: 7-August 06
Member No.: 572



Ok, this is nice and all, but it doesn't answer the question of why people who buy accounts can hold positions like carnage host.


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Hatiki
post Nov 1 2006, 09:57 PM
Post #13


General of Koguryo Army
Group Icon

Group: Retired Staff
Posts: 586
Joined: 25-July 06
From: Vancouver, BC
Member No.: 491
Characters: Hatiki



Well unless their is proof that someone purchased an account, there is nothing anyone can do. If you do have proof then you should send to KRU and i'm sure they'll ban the account and then you won't have to worry about bought accounts holding a carnage host position.


--------------------
"Conspiracy, scandals, truths and slight truths."
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Forum Troll
post Nov 1 2006, 11:00 PM
Post #14


Il san
Group Icon

Group: Citizens
Posts: 191
Joined: 3-July 06
Member No.: 52



QUOTE(Hatiki @ Nov 1 2006, 07:09 PM) [snapback]15957[/snapback]

I'm not friends with any of these hosts, minus AznAngelz. I don't have vent and I hate hunting and I was just hired.


Well there you go. Friends with AzNAngelz was enoughto get host. Good job.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Hatiki
post Nov 1 2006, 11:18 PM
Post #15


General of Koguryo Army
Group Icon

Group: Retired Staff
Posts: 586
Joined: 25-July 06
From: Vancouver, BC
Member No.: 491
Characters: Hatiki



QUOTE(Forum Troll @ Nov 1 2006, 09:00 PM) [snapback]15977[/snapback]

Well there you go. Friends with AzNAngelz was enoughto get host. Good job.


I'm pretty sure she isn't the only one who picks the hosts. And I applied for Carnage Host many times in the past when she was a host and wasn't accepted. So you are mistaken.

My 10th or 11th try was when I was finally accepted.


--------------------
"Conspiracy, scandals, truths and slight truths."
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
SilentS
post Nov 2 2006, 12:02 AM
Post #16


Sa san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 2,151
Joined: 3-July 06
From: Edmonton
Member No.: 26



When I applied to be a host, I wasnt friends with any of them. A few days later Ahalya summoned me into her house, asked a series of questions while the Division Heads were present, then was told I could leave. Later that day found out I was accepted. Was my only time applying too.

I knew most there because of dealings in the past, and maybe being Elder probably contributed in me being accepted. But friends had nothing to do with it. And one thing I learned was that being a host wasnt as easy as I initially thought it would be. But it does take alot of common sense.

As for them being bought/sold accounts. Show proof to Kru and let them deal with it. Saying it here or on the Comm does nothing. Mainly because people love to spread rumors that are false most of the time. This is the day and age where people believe what they see, not everything they hear.


--------------------
IPB Image
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
solman
post Nov 2 2006, 12:06 AM
Post #17


Oh san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 2,560
Joined: 4-July 06
Member No.: 104



Speaking as a former host I will say this. It doesn't matter what kind of standing you have with a certain host. Its all division heads plus the head hosts who do sort out these applications are the people who in turn get approved or denied.

When I was first hired I knew most of the hosts. There was actually quite a bit of controversy when I was first hired just for who I was being cdc. Believe me most hosts hated myself as cdc and didn't know what they were getting. Yet I proved I knew about carnages on a daily basis (or so I like to think) which lead to myself being given a chance.

So to say its always friends picked only really isn't the case. It might be the case currently but as long as I ever knew, this was never the case when it resorted to carnage host applicants.


--------------------
Time to do the naked Pee Pee dance.

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Worldwalker
post Nov 2 2006, 05:15 AM
Post #18


Sa san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 1,413
Joined: 4-July 06
Member No.: 131



I would be more willing to believe the accusations against the Carnage staff if I hadn't heard exactly the same accusations when I was an assistant, a host, a division head, and finally head host. Are they true? Maybe. But I know that when Wasse's staff was accused of the same things, they weren't true. I know when Rashidi's staff was accused of those things, it wasn't true either. And as Falaris can testify, it certainly wasn't true on my staff. He was at the meetings when we screened applicants. (yes, back in those days, the head Carnage host was actually the person in charge, not some anonymous archon) He knows the people some of us remained neutral on because they were either friends or enemies, and either way we didn't want to influence the selection.

Falaris is right. We picked the people we thought could do the best job of running Carnage.

The first cut was based on the head host's quick review of their applications. It's downright scary how many I tossed out for inability to follow directions -- starting with putting their name in the right place on the form. If they can't get that much right, how are they going to be able to do something as complicated as run a Carnage -- or even fill out a hosting report?

Are things any different now? I don't know. I just know you can't tell because every head host, every Carnage staff, that I knew was accused of exactly what they're being accused of now. I was accused of the same. And whatever you may think of me as a human being, few, I think, would question my honesty, my integrity, and my honor.


-- Worldwalker


--------------------
Honor. Duty. Responsibility. Courage. Courtesy. Generosity. Pride.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Airadine
post Nov 2 2006, 10:47 PM
Post #19


Il san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 250
Joined: 4-July 06
Member No.: 92
Characters: Airess, Airadine, Aireona



I used to go through every application submitted. The first thing I would do is write down every name and then search for the names in our report database to see if they have past reported problems of bad behavior in carnages, if they have been banned, etc.

1 out of every 10 came out clean. Those are the ones who I submitted for approval to be hired.

The other 9? Well they are the ones who go on comm or nexus forums and complain how bad <insert whatever name of head host here> is corrupt for not hiring them.

I remember a time when the archon took the ability to hire new hosts away from the carnage staff and reviewed every single application herself. I gave her about 30 of them and she denied about 25 of them. The very next day more posts were found on Nexus Forums about how corrupt the head host was for not hiring them. He never once seen any of the applications, let alone had anything to do with the denial of hiring them.

It's really simple. If you want to be a carnage host never give up applying. Attend every single carnage you can and NEVER get in trouble while in carnage.

When I applied to be a host I got denied for an entire year but I didn't stop applying and I didn't stop attending carnages and I didn't go trashing people under fake names on the forums.

I knew only one carnage host when I got hired.
DryWater had been a host a whole week or two (maybe a month) at that time.
I became friends with all those people after the fact.

As for the comments about Cooolboyman. He was telling the truth. He didn't know any of us when he was hired. When we interviewed him he gave good answers. We voted on him based on his answers alone, since none of us knew him. He didn't get "lucky", he got hired because he had the right answers.






Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
koKura
post Nov 5 2006, 11:56 AM
Post #20


Il san
Group Icon

Group: Nobles
Posts: 204
Joined: 6-July 06
From: Calgary, AB, CA
Member No.: 177



Another example to go along with Cooolboyman's...

When I applied for carnage host, I had never applied before. Also, not only did I not know a single person on the then carnage staff, I hadn't ever even SPOKEN to any of them, at any point, to my recollection.

Needless to say, I was very surprised, and happy when I got a letter from 'CarnyApp' two weeks or so later saying my application had been accepted.


--------------------
IPB Image


I also play WoW. SkullCrusher server, Horde faction.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

13 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 

RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 28th March 2024 - 06:18 PM
Nexus Forums is part of: Nexus Atlas © all rights reserved.