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> Playing The Market
The market and its economy
What are your views on playing the market?
A decent alternate way to earn cash [ 19 ] ** [86.36%]
An unfair way of earning money [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
A smart, but unethical way of earning money [ 3 ] ** [13.64%]
Total Votes: 22
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dondon
post Nov 11 2006, 07:40 AM
Post #1


Il san
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Group: Nobles
Posts: 166
Joined: 4-July 06
Member No.: 129



So.. Tell me your views on this!

I'm a weaver; when I buy wools and weave/tailor, I simply lose way too much money.

So what I did was buying wools slowly at 8k/25 and selling them at 2m/5k. With that 400k profit, I buy wools again, weave and tailor the result.

Apparently, there's this someone in game who is unhappy (or jealous? or irked? or shooed?) the way I make money and in the same time increase my crafting skills. Heck, this someone even went as far as to put me on F9 list! laugh.gif Quite amusing I must say.

Also just to add on, this someone asked me about my stone axe. I never saged that I was selling it at first, she was the one who asked me about it - and I was being honest with her and said that I bought it for 1.5 million coins, and being someone who wants to earn as MUCH as profit as I can, I'm opening a price of 2 million coins and told her to bargain as she like seeing how she's a friend of mine.

Note the keyword: "I'm opening a price"

So she offered 5k wools - and I agreed. A few days passed, I asked her how it's going. She freaked out and said "I'd rather deal with someone honest"; and rambled on how I was trying to trick and scam her into believing it was worth 2 million coins.

I was like.. "'scuse me?" - never did I said the CURRENT PRICE for a stone axe was 2 million coins (heck, isn't it anyway?). PLUS, say the current price is about 1.5 million coins. Why would I waste even more of my time to get 2 million coins? It's like me knowing the price of 25 wools are 8k, and I'm trying to sell 25 wools for 12k. It just doesn't make sense.

I'm starting to understand the whole announcement everclear made on the comm board ages ago on a merchant's mind of making money.

It's funny though. What's more amusing, I was F9'ed blink.gif
[end of ramble]

So anyway - what do you guys say? Vote and reply! tongue.gif
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koKura
post Nov 11 2006, 10:43 AM
Post #2


Il san
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Group: Nobles
Posts: 204
Joined: 6-July 06
From: Calgary, AB, CA
Member No.: 177



I chose the first option.

Reason being? I don't see anything wrong with it. BUT (of course, there's always a but..) there's always a point where there CAN be something wrong with it (ie. you're being unhonest). But there's nothing wrong with buying items for cheap/smaller amounts and then selling them for more! The 'nexus market' is based primarily upon what people are WILLING to BOTH sell and buy for.

You could buy something fairly cheaply, and try to sell it for more - and never be able to sell it because no one needs it/wants it. This I think happens a lot in the current market, there's too many things circling around and not enough of them being consumed (point being: I can't even sell level 50 hand items for 40k - without looking for a few DAYS usually. A few months ago I had no problems selling them for 60k+).

In our economy, we can sell and buy things for however much we want to. It doesn't mean we're scamming ANYone. It's a matter of that person being either a - ignorant as to not knowing the 'common' prices, or b - willing to pay whatever to get this item they absolutely must have for whatever reason or c - who knows what else.

A lot of 'buying and selling for profit' comes down to ones integrity - if someone is truly ignorant of the standard price for something, and you're selling above that, and they buy it, it IS their own fault for not asking around to find out what the standard price is - now if they ask you this (this is an example.. as I know you stated you thought they were 2m anyway), and you, knowing fully well that that stone axe goes for 1.5m and you're selling for 2m and you tell them 2m - that is where the problem is. You're lying to try to make that sale.


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I also play WoW. SkullCrusher server, Horde faction.
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Sxymail
post Nov 11 2006, 01:12 PM
Post #3


Level 99
**

Group: Citizens
Posts: 43
Joined: 9-July 06
Member No.: 285



I've basically made ALL of my money from playing the market, and I've never had someone accuse me of being dishonest/scammer/whatever. I don't know how the stone axe thing went since I wasn't there, but there's nothing wrong with buying something in mass quantities and reselling it. If you are located in a capitalistic society, this is how business works, yet we do not see Americans getting upset that someone is making money off of the shirt they are buying at Walmart. I feel some people just get angry when someone they know starts to get ahead.

However when buying and selling you do need to learn to deal with things a certain way in order to prevent this type of negative viewpoint. For example, I have always made sure my prices are reasonable for the item. If I don't know the value, I will not sell it, simple as that. This works on both ends because I won't get ripped off, and I know the other party is not cheated as well. This way anytime I sell something, I know they won't leave feeling that I outright cheated them for not knowing prices. They say, wow his price was right around everyone elses, I'm glad I didn't get ripped off!

That's just one example, but there are plenty more methods to use depending on the person.

Sxy
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Tynan
post Nov 11 2006, 06:16 PM
Post #4


Ee san
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Group: Nobles
Posts: 506
Joined: 3-July 06
From: British Columbia, Canada
Member No.: 12



Playing the market is both enjoyable and lucrative, if you are good at it.

Starting with a fairly small amount of venture capital (around 2 million), I have turned it into over 5 million in less than one week, all the while being honest. You do, however, have to know the market and put in time.

The key thing to remember is that you are providing a fair exchange so long as you are not lying. If this is the case, then both parties should be satisfied.

By the way, the best ways to make money in my opinion are:

- buying craftables in small amounts at the normal price (wool at 8K/25, dark ambers at 90K/100) and reselling in bulk for more (sort of slow but very reliable and impossible to screw up)

- buying rares and vortex items for cheap from people who need fast cash, and then selling them at a normal price, such as buying a Flameblade for 3M and reselling for 4M (I have made millions doing things like this)

A good way to lose money, or at least waste your time, are investing in small items that do not move quickly. Like, when Bloods were dirt cheap, I was not tempted to buy tons for little simply because they are more difficult to sell later. Selling 200+ Bloods is a pain in the ass, truly. Stick to things people buy in bulk (craftables) and big-ticket items (rares) and you will waste less of your time and see faster, larger profits.
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dondon
post Nov 11 2006, 08:53 PM
Post #5


Il san
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Group: Nobles
Posts: 166
Joined: 4-July 06
Member No.: 129



QUOTE(koKura @ Nov 11 2006, 10:43 PM) [snapback]17400[/snapback]

A lot of 'buying and selling for profit' comes down to ones integrity - if someone is truly ignorant of the standard price for something, and you're selling above that, and they buy it, it IS their own fault for not asking around to find out what the standard price is - now if they ask you this (this is an example.. as I know you stated you thought they were 2m anyway), and you, knowing fully well that that stone axe goes for 1.5m and you're selling for 2m and you tell them 2m- that is where the problem is. You're lying to try to make that sale.


Here where the problem lies. Being able to buy a stone axe for 1.5m doesn't make the current price necessarily be 1.5m!

Truth is, I totally have no idea about the price; but as I mentioned, being someone who wants to make as much profit as I can, I opened the price at 2m - again, I opened the price; open meaning they are still allowed to negotiate, haggle, bargain, whatever.

I stand by the fact that seriously, if I know stone axe goes for 1.5m and it's not that "almighty great", I'd turn bald before I can sell it for 2m. Back to my first perspective - isn't stone axe worth AROUND 2m anyway? .. or so I was told by a merchant on the very moment she asked how much I want for it.

Sometimes I don't get the logic - if it's just me being really dishonest (by telling her how much am I looking [but not the market price] and she made the offer HERSELF [i didn't even bargain for more]), or is it that she just has this bad thoughts because I merely buy wools from other people and sell it for a higher amount.

laugh.gif
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Rachel
post Nov 11 2006, 09:54 PM
Post #6


Oh san
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Group: Retired Staff
Posts: 4,874
Joined: 4-July 06
Member No.: 85
Characters: Rachel



Item values are determined by what people are willing to sell them for and what people are willing to pay.

It's really simple. If you think someone is charging too much, don't buy it. If you think someone isn't paying enough, don't sell it.


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Work continues on the continuation of the Story
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Akidoshi
post Nov 12 2006, 10:47 AM
Post #7


Level 99
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Group: Citizens
Posts: 77
Joined: 11-November 06
Member No.: 1,166



Be smart. Don't sage buying wool 8k/25, selling wool 10k/25. That is just freaking retarted and makes me want to smash things with my fist.

Go ahead and advertise your 8k/25 buying price. Then go ahead and advertise your 2m/5k selling price. Just don't do both at the same time. Not sure why, but it comes off as you being a greedy jerk.

On the flip side, both are reasonable because it takes two to tango, or in this case it takes two to transact. Sweet.

ALSO, there is one thing I want to add.

Buy low sell high. Good theory. The only problem is when there are insight 50-75 people that cannot get wool NEARLY as fast as someone that is 99 who despperately need ogre items and weapons, yet those things are so freaking expensive. People that try selling these people who are just getting a grasp of prices jacked up prices are freaking retards that need smacked in the face with a sack of metal coins. That is all.


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Michike
post Nov 14 2006, 06:21 AM
Post #8


Ee san
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Group: Nobles
Posts: 458
Joined: 4-July 06
From: Brussels, Belgium
Member No.: 78



It's just stupid, some people will be jealous that you're making money, nothing more, nothing less. No matter how you do it. The fact that they found out that the way you made money involved only buying things from player A and selling it to player B poses them a conscience problem because they don't think like a trader. Fact is that three people are perfectly happy in the transactions you make as an intermediary. 1. the seller is happy because they got the money they wanted, 2. the buyer is happy because they got the item they wanted and 3, you are happy because the time you invested in it made you a profit. Someone that isn't happy with a transaction being made simply doesn't make it. No regrets afterwards, at the time you made the transaction it was what the item was worth to you. What the item is worth in the market is not important to a buyer or a seller, it's only important to a trader who needs to know if something is a good sale or a good buy or what average market prices are.

I'm a gatherer myself, I don't care for the market much but I will only sell my crafting resources at a price I can live with. I tend to only pay "valuables" the price I want to buy them at, it's not that hard of a logic. Simple example when I was doing my moon quest it was close to impossible to find people selling Whisper bracelets, I went outside of carnage hall before it started and shout at players enterring that I would buy whisper bracelets for 100k, i got them fast, that's what mattered. More power to those lucky enough to benefit from that. Playing the market is risky business, any profit you earn is to cover that risk.


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Michike Kamiyama R.I.P.
QUOTE (Alston @ Feb 15 2010, 04:12 PM) *
Nexus is a big example of how most governmental systems work (with a few differences, of course).
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